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Messages - MarasAndBuddhas

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1
Secular Buddhism / Re: I almost hate to say it, but ........
« on: June 07, 2021, 05:13:16 PM »
Yeah, well, "secular buddhism" is somewhat oxymoronic, yet one doesn't have to label oneself anything in order to practice...

i think all the religious ornaments have the quality of bringing together people in a group, that's their power. If i had to choose any label it would be "confused buddhist", because i just don't have much in the way of "beliefs" except a vague sketch of what is polite and incorrect or impolite and rude.

I've learned a lot from this "global pandemic", yet it has been pretty horrible for my ability to meditate. I resolved recently i'm just going to shorten my time to 10 minutes, we'll how see how that works out.

2
Danger Zone / Re: east and west
« on: May 22, 2021, 01:21:54 AM »
I personally think that arguing with people on Facebook is pointless.  It reminds me of the old cartoon -- a man unable to go to bed because someone is WRONG on the internet! 

The advantage of Free Sangha is that everyone, at least in theory, is trying to follow the right speech guidelines. -- not because of moderation but because this is an integral part of Dharma practice.  Of course, we fail at this all the time, because we are human, but the thing to do is pick oneself up and try again.   

If traveling to the Far East, my pick would be Taiwan instead of mainland China.  It has preserved more traditional attitudes to culture and religion.  Be forewarned that, if you want to learn enough Chinese for religious practice, it would take a major effort on your part.

yeah, there are a couple of different forms of chinese, and in order to translate the original "Tao Te Ching" I would need to also learn caligraphy, none of this is easy but i could make a stab at it with all the right preparations.

3
Danger Zone / Re: east and west
« on: May 18, 2021, 03:38:26 PM »
The thing for me, was, that we were dealing with something that was posted.  A lot of people would have taken offense at it.  The fact that Avisitor sorta apologized, saying it wasn't meant to be rude, confrontational, etc.  Indicated that he knew it could be taken that way.  Rather than write, and then apologize for it, doesn't make everything ok, at least in my mind.  ITAM, if you have to apologize for something right after writing, it's best to un-write it and find another way to express yourself.

There's an old custom with forums to advise people to sit on a post overnight before submitting it.  If there's some heat in what's been written, a good night's sleep can temper those feelings.

I agree with you completely: i took a break because I felt ashamed of my aggression/abuse of a moderator who i've known for a long time and has never before treated me as a problem.

Before i further back up that behavior with worthless excuses (as i tend to remember what i do very well, as I'm also good at lieing and stealing if i stay focused)...I just want to say:

The "duality of the western world" simply doesn't exist. What the more skilled mindfulness practitioners/buddhists mean by this is that our current world is dominated by arrogant intellectualism, or at least the professional aspect of it is. "We confuse reality with our thoughts", as a great therapist once told me.

The talk about "east and west" came from an issue i was having on facebook: Even though i thought the murder of George Floyd was really sad, it was really upsetting to me that every post became political demagoguery in a heart beat. Yes, it's sad: people believe in the moral hyperbole of journalism. I was fine with argueing with people about the extent that we should all just wash our hands and stay inside all the time (telling someone to "stay home" on facebook)...but somebody insinuated i was "racist" because i joked that "maybe i'll vote for trump since steve bannon misspent the money for the border wall".

I don't vote because i just don't trust politicians to do what they say they're going to do, the murder of George Floyd had nothing to do with "donald trump's racism": it had more to with the fact that:

-the police enforce this stupid thing called "the law", and the law authorizes the police to break the law. Not all cops are "evil" white supremacists. I'm almost as "white" as an albino and cops have screwed with me because i don't always act so predictably. I typically like going for walks, and i've gotten a lot of !@#$ from people for just walking around. With an exception of times i've committed traffic violations, cops have just bothered me because someone called the police on me for walking. Some lady accused me of robbing her house also because I was just walking around.

-Black people still suffer from being enslaved in this country [founded on white supremacy and Christianity], and the cops can only really go after poor people.

-Poverty always makes crime more tempting, hence the reason that "the ghetto" is associated with drug dealers and prisoners.

-The police make split second judgments in order to control what they see as a threat. If a "dangerous black person" is seen as a threat, then that black person is going to die.

The real reason I've been thinking about traveling to China for a while to:

-to learn different styles of chinese so that I can better understand the original taoist texts, and perhaps make a new translation. I don't really care much about "The Buddha" or some monk who "has fewer desires", or occupies some position of zen authority. I think Buddha's wisdom puts most of the documents that universities churn out to shame, but i consider myself more of a taoist, and if i ever feel comfortable traveling anywhere ever again as a vulnerable tourist with money, I WILL. However, i have no pretensions about Chinese people being anymore enlightened, or there being any unique spiritual wisdom in "the east".

-travel! It's fun to see different places, and you learn more through traveling than being stuck in a set of routines. However, as an adult i have found that i just can't tolerate "partying" anymore, nor can I tolerate the attitudes of those who do it.

Yes zen buddhists and partiers: sleeping is important for your brain functioning even if it isn't always so important.

Also, chaz: i can't compartmentalize so well as just to avoid politics altogether. The political is personal, and you can't be neutral on a moving train.


4
Danger Zone / Re: east and west
« on: May 16, 2021, 01:19:51 AM »
i'm sorry that my thread degraded into insults...i'm sorry that i was sarcastic and insulting, but can you tell me about a particular form of right and wrong speech? I feel like i constantly have an issue with this...but yes, i am sorry that i cause suffering and %^&* with people at times. I've been trying to meditate a whole lot but something just seems to always get in the way.

This is the danger zone, is this then a dangerous place to talk about things? Please answer my questions.

5
Danger Zone / Re: east and west
« on: May 14, 2021, 12:18:33 AM »

I see you like to be difficult and contrary. But, take it however you like.
My meaning was to not get upset with anything I said. Cause I am not trying to be rude, difficult or contrary.
 ;D ;D ;D ;D
[/quote]

LOL, people can be so apologetic when theirs an impeding fear of DOOM and FIRE

6
Danger Zone / Re: east and west
« on: May 12, 2021, 01:21:54 PM »
Quote
i'm just curious if people from what's referred to the east and west really think in tremendously different ways. Ideas about this are a lot of the reason why Americans and Europeans turn to buddhism.

Overall this is kind of sensitive and problematic discussion, yet I do think it's worth having. In strict buddhism your not even really supposed to talk about other people, but you can have insights or study the way that people different from yourself think.

The east and west may contain a lot of differences between themselves, but I'm sure if you went there, and got to know the people from the east, you would find that they are not tremendously different from "the westeners".

Quote
Buddhism is perfect for asking questions. Buddha never made anyone believe in blind faith.
You are suppose to ask questions and verify for yourself.

sure..buddhism is perfect for asking questions, but what makes buddhism in particular perfect for question-asking? Why am i "supposed to" ask questions about it?

Quote
Life, taken as a whole, is perfect for asking questions.  I'd see it as a right.

If you choose to to surrendder that, it's entirely on you.

To say that Buddhism encourages questioning and other traditions don't, is a little narrow minded.  That's to say that to believe that is bad is equally short-sighted.  The things is all faith traditons, Buddhism included, have a positive component of faith - complete trust in someone or something. The "complete" component, presupposes a level of blindness - belief in the absense of physical evidence.  I have many firends who practice their failth "blindly", and y'know what?  They're fine.  Their lives have been their verification.  What can you say?

-I don't think that "life is perfect for asking questions" if you are a cat, or if you are human and don't want to ask questions...or are very troubled by asking questions.

-asking questions is a RIGHT? So I am entitled to my questions, and if i am not entitled to my questions then i just shouldn't ask them?

-if you have a problem with me putting "redneck" in quotes out of a misinterpretation  of something that you said/thought, then i think it's equally troubling to put words in Avisitor's mouth. Not all religions/belief-systems/philosophies are the same. If i had a belief system with a commandment or precept which stated (i.e., "thou shalt not ask questions", or "the precept of non-skepticism") then clearly buddhism is "better" or "more perfect" for asking questions than my belief system.

Quote
Hindu spirituality and Buddhism is quite different
But, if you don't know enough about it or are just looking for similarities then that is what you will find.

actually, what i found from reading pali texts and talking to Buddhists is that The Buddha was basically looking to reform asceticism and replace it with a different system of constraints and assertions about "the nature of reality", but you are correct that not all hindu "spiritual" ideas are the same as the ideas espoused by The Buddha. I've always wanted to some traveling in the far eastern part of the earth but i don't know if i'm ever going to feel comfortable about doing that for all sorts of reasons.

Quote
Note: Please do not take anything I say personally.
There is no intent to be rude or attack.
It is just my personality taking over the conversation.
Ego is sometimes a hard thing to keep in check

-Huh, i don't really see how it's possible to not take "anything you say" personally, as you are a person, and i can't help but take everything in my life personally.

-What is this "ego" that you "need to keep in check"? I personally don't think an ego is anything but this image you have of yourself, and how you appear to others. Are you referring to Freud's ego?

7
Danger Zone / Re: east and west
« on: May 12, 2021, 09:12:58 AM »
Quote
i'm just curious if people from what's referred to the east and west really think in tremendously different ways. Ideas about this are a lot of the reason why Americans and Europeans turn to buddhism.

Overall this is kind of sensitive and problematic discussion, yet I do think it's worth having. In strict buddhism your not even really supposed to talk about other people, but you can have insights or study the way that people different from yourself think.

The east and west may contain a lot of differences between themselves, but I'm sure if you went there, and got to know the people from the east, you would find that they are not tremendously different from people "the west".

Quote
Buddhism is perfect for asking questions. Buddha never made anyone believe in blind faith.
You are suppose to ask questions and verify for yourself.

sure..buddhism is perfect for asking questions, but what makes buddhism in particular perfect for question-asking? Why am i "supposed to" ask questions about it?

Quote
Life, taken as a whole, is perfect for asking questions.  I'd see it as a right.

If you choose to to surrendder that, it's entirely on you.

To say that Buddhism encourages questioning and other traditions don't, is a little narrow minded.  That's to say that to believe that is bad is equally short-sighted.  The things is all faith traditons, Buddhism included, have a positive component of faith - complete trust in someone or something. The "complete" component, presupposes a level of blindness - belief in the absense of physical evidence.  I have many firends who practice their failth "blindly", and y'know what?  They're fine.  Their lives have been their verification.  What can you say?

-I don't think that "life is perfect for asking questions" if you are a cat, or if you are human and don't want to ask questions...or are very troubled by asking questions.

-asking questions is a RIGHT? So I am entitled to my questions, and if i am not entitled to my questions then i just shouldn't ask them?

-if you have a problem with me putting "redneck" in quotes out of a misinterpretation  of something that you said/thought, then i think it's equally troubling to put words in Avisitor's mouth. Not all religions/belief-systems/philosophies are the same. If i had a belief system with a commandment or precept which stated (i.e., "thou shalt not ask questions", or "the precept of non-skepticism") then clearly buddhism is "better" or "more perfect" for asking questions than my belief system.

Quote
Hindu spirituality and Buddhism is quite different
But, if you don't know enough about it or are just looking for similarities then that is what you will find.

actually, what i found from reading pali texts and talking to Buddhists is that The Buddha was basically looking to reform asceticism and replace it with a different system of constraints and assertions about "the nature of reality", but you are correct that not all hindu "spiritual" ideas are the same as the ideas espoused by The Buddha. I've always wanted to some traveling in the far eastern part of the earth but i don't know if i'm ever going to feel comfortable about doing that for all sorts of reasons.

Quote
Note: Please do not take anything I say personally.
There is no intent to be rude or attack.
It is just my personality taking over the conversation.
Ego is sometimes a hard thing to keep in check

-Huh, i don't really see how it's possible to not take "anything you say" personally, as you are a person, and i can't help but take everything in my life personally.

-What is this "ego" that you "need to keep in check"? I personally don't think an ego is anything but this image you have of yourself, and how you appear to others. Are you referring to Freud's ego?




8
Open Discussion / Re: Fear, Attatchment, and Suffering
« on: December 13, 2020, 04:29:59 PM »
you know, i didn't even want to look at some of the responses to some of the more passionate and angry things i said on here, but im just totally unsurprised. You just erase things when you don't like it. That doesn't make this a more moral or Buddhist forum by the way, to have fewer and fewer content. It just reflects existing conventions, something that monastic buddhists understandably don't have much of a problem with.

Anyways,
peace and love from a former buddhist.

9
Danger Zone / Re: east and west
« on: November 23, 2020, 11:37:04 PM »
i'm glad you are learning about rural america, i

You presume too much.  I don't live in a rural area.

Quote
yet i've found that people in cities are just as prejudicial and suspicious towards strangers, so I don't know how I would work that out other than being perfect,


It really doesn't make any sense to me if you are telling me not to try to be perfect if you are doing the typical thing that people do: you impose double standards of communication. For instance, i wasn't calling anyone a redneck, i just assumed you were because you made a GROSS GENERALIZATION about "the people where you live". I shouldn't be the only person who has to be careful about what they assume about other people, %^&*ing practice what you preach, i'm tired of everyone being a total hypocrite.

You can't be perfect.  Don't try.

Trungpa Rinpoche once said that Buddhism was about becoming a genuine human being.  That doesn't not include being "perfect", whatever that means.


Quote
so I don't know how I would work that out in the long run without tremendous suffering.

If you try to become something that's impossible to achieve, I guarantee you will suffer for it.

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Danger Zone / Re: east and west
« on: November 23, 2020, 08:59:07 PM »
you seem like a very calm and non-egotistical buddhist

11
Danger Zone / Re: east and west
« on: November 20, 2020, 11:39:01 PM »
I can't help but presuming when other people make such broad statements as "...people here [where?] would rather talk about NASCAR than duality...", standard internet affair, people just wait for some moment to criticize somebody else or tell them what to do. I would really love to never make unfair generalizations about other people but doesn't seem possible. I basically just have to try to play along with everyone else's generalizations. Have fun with your fuzzy lollypops, I'll be back when I need some reading material.

Except that I live in in SC and that people here seem to value NASCAR over duality as conversational fare, I never said anything to even suggest I live in a rural setting.  That's on you.

You don't have to rely on the generalizations that others establish.  Create your own or try not to generalize.

You are sanctimonious, i didn't force you to respond to the topic, you went ahead and did it anyway because you clearly thought you were helping me or something. There's nothing wrong with leaving your forum blank until better content comes along.

You clearly haven't learned anything. Obviously not everyone in SC likes NASCAR, I'm so %^&*ing tired of other peoples dumb as hell generalizations, it's a nightmare, %^&* you. I'm tired of hearing one type of person say "the welfare cheats ruin everything! the immigrants steal!", and then the other person say "america is white supremacist! white supremacists are ruining democracy!".

I also don't fully rely on other people's generalizations...but that's part of being a human, is you rely on information that other people give you, I can't make them out of thin air unless I'm either lying or writing stories. I find very questionable the idea that "attachment leads to suffering", so am I supposed to believe an attachment believe an infant and a mother always without a doubt leads to suffering? Seems like a lot of people don't want to question ancient religious ideas. But what would buddhism be if they did?

All sanghas seem to either want you to torture yourself or lie to you, so what's the point? I don't see why more people don't practice meditation alone and fully divorce it from hindu spirituality and buddhism (there's very little difference between the two...). I wanted to put this in a much shorter message but your programming clearly still doesn't %^&*ing work. It would have taken you much less time and effort to tell me what a TOS is...

12
Danger Zone / Re: east and west
« on: November 20, 2020, 07:56:36 PM »
i'm glad you are learning about rural america, i

You presume too much.  I don't live in a rural area.

Quote
yet i've found that people in cities are just as prejudicial and suspicious towards strangers, so I don't know how I would work that out other than being perfect,

i wouldn't presume anything if people didn't give me non-specific information, for example, telling me that "nobody here cares about anything except

You can't be perfect.  Don't try.

Trungpa Rinpoche once said that Buddhism was about becoming a genuine human being.  That doesn't not include being "perfect", whatever that means.


Quote
so I don't know how I would work that out in the long run without tremendous suffering.

If you try to become something that's impossible to achieve, I guarantee you will suffer for it.

I can't help but presuming when other people make such broad statements as "...people here [where?] would rather talk about NASCAR than duality...", standard internet affair, people just wait for some moment to criticize somebody else or tell them what to do. I would really love to never make unfair generalizations about other people but doesn't seem possible. I basically just have to try to play along with everyone else's generalizations. Have fun with your fuzzy lollypops, I'll be back when I need some reading material.

13
Danger Zone / Re: east and west
« on: November 20, 2020, 07:08:38 PM »
my bad, i guess i just thought that's what you meant since there's that joke: "What does NASCAR stand for? Non-athletic sport centered around rednecks"...there also has been a pretty tremendous amount of prejudice centered around people from certain states like the one you live in, mostly on the internet, mostly because of a certain president...

The people down here have been getting the fuzzy end of the lollipop from the rest of the country for a long time.  When we decided to move down here we had friends who doubted our sanity, based on their perception of what things are like here.  Happy to say it ain't so - at least to the extent of their fears and predjudices.

This conveniently points to your topic of duality.  People in the North percienve the South differently - less that their own - inferior - egregious. They do this to feel better about themselves.  I call it Othering.

And yes, it causes suffering.

i'm glad you are learning about rural america, i try to get people to come out here sometimes yet cities seem to offer people more stuff. You also don't need to own a car in a metropolitan area, which is an advantage on many different levels...yet i've found that people in cities are just as prejudicial and suspicious towards strangers, so I don't know how I would work that out other than being perfect, so I don't know how I would work that out in the long run without tremendous suffering.

14
Danger Zone / Re: east and west
« on: November 20, 2020, 02:46:32 AM »
You could probably find ways of talking about duality with those supposed "rednecks" <snip>

People down here?  They're not "redencks".  They're people.  There are three things that matter down here - NASCAR, Church and Barbeque (not necessarily in that order). They just don't care about dualiity.  Most people don't.  I don't blame them.

my bad, i guess i just thought that's what you meant since there's that joke: "What does NASCAR stand for? Non-athletic sport centered around rednecks"...there also has been a pretty tremendous amount of prejudice centered around people from certain states like the one you live in, mostly on the internet, mostly because of a certain president...

15
Danger Zone / Re: east and west
« on: November 20, 2020, 02:01:20 AM »
You could probably find ways of talking about duality with those supposed "rednecks", but I guess I shouldn't post anything unless I'm extremely specific. Each person is a different window into reality, or as Indian spiritualists talk about it, "The Self", but I'm still not sure what they mean by that, I still meditate regardless, but maybe meditation will teach me more about that in time...

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